Fighting the War/Journey to America-Thai Vue-January 31, 2002

TVUE103,Introduction,Thai Vue,January 31, 2002,Transcribed by Brianna
SC: Hi, welcome to the Hmong research center this is our speaker for Thursday. I am very proud and thankful for having our speaker today he spoke with our class for about 6 years now and he has a wonderful presentation everytime. I would like you to meet Thai Vue from the Hmong Mutual Association.
TV: Hi, good morning. My name is Thai Vue Thai Thai can you say Thai Thai Yes, Thai Vue. I have a lot of people call me "Tye Vue" ok its ok Thai Vue but if you go to a Hmong community especially you go o Laos and say "Tye Vue" people will not know who’s "Tye Vue." Uh its called Thai Thai Vue. Its Tow right? Tow right?
SC: Yeah.
TV: Ok but what is what your name is called in Hmong is Bah or Baw? Bah right? Ok so the name is usually sounded in English to well, (Tye) is easy for a non-Hmong speaker to say. Ok, ok that’s why I say Thai, but really Thai. Here is bah bah right bah so if you go home mom and dad probably call you go and say (inaudible) see that’s the difference ok and the other thing that’s Tow and Bah or Thai and "Tye." We have a different meaning.
Ok uh we have an ember my name is actually a definition its ember where the black smith pounding and mad a tools. Ok what we going to talk about today is we can talk about the (inaudible) in Laos the Journey to the United states. Ok and uh if your go here any questions uh stop me and we will talk about your question then move on ok, make yourself feel comfortable. Don’t be shy ok uh you see right there.
Thai Vue on the top and the inaudible say (Thai Vwj) ok uh this V here will have the tone I (Tye) and then this J here will have the tone Vue Vue Vue Thai Vue. This name here doesn’t have the tone it doesn’t have the pitch. So you can’t always say Thai Vue Thai Vue ok so I think the first part or the most important lesson today is just to understand that this is Thai Vue ok and and I wok for the lacrosse Area Hmong Mutual Association Inv.
So we going to talk about the Hmong history in Laos, The journey to the United States of America but first I would like to put this to see a little bit here just a little bit the Hmong.
TV: Hi in Hmong is usually Nyob Nyob zoo (Nyo Yoo) right ok is that pretty hard to say? Nyob Byob Zoo… and then good morning is Nyob Zoo Sawv Ntxov (Nyo Zoo sher Jao Nyob Zoo Sawv Ntxov… and then my name is, lets put my name Thai Thai Vue Kuv Lub Npe Hu va. Thai Vue again Uh all right I speak very little Hmong, Kuv Hais Tav Lus Hmoob Me Me xwb. Again…

TVUE203,Background Information,Thai Vue,January 28, 2002,Transcribed by Alex
TV: Anyone of you have seen a Hmong person? Have you seen a Hmong person? Where did you see a Hmong person? In school. Those of you haven't seen, you are you are watching one. I am a Hmong person. And I'm gonna show you some pictures that we take at the Hmong association- should have been about Hmong- about the Hmong and then I know you seen it, here in school. But this picture is also show you, about the Hmong. This is a Hmong girl, this is a Hmong man dressed n their custom. Ok, so every time when I say, or somebody say Hmong, -he probably- I saw one.
TV:Thai Vue in the class was like this, that when I dress in Hmong custom outfit that would be like this. This picture that taken at Hmong New Year every year in October. Uhà Dress are very different- different kind of dress- Hmong make different dresses. Uh, most of us dress like this. Like here. This is me. Still Thai Vue, so these are the Hmong people. Hmong people also have party, concert, have fun. This is at the La Crosse Center. At the Hmong New Year concert in La Crosse Center every year.
TV:This picture is a Hmong girl from Thailand. What I just show you here was in La Crosse, but this picture is a Hmong girl from Thailand. It's the same as this one. It's also from Thailand. Hmong live in China, Laos, in Thailand, in the United States, and maybe other country. I'll show you a little bit about how many Hmong live in Wisconsin today. It's about 40,000 Hmong in Wisconsin. In here in La Crosse we have about 3,300, it's about 3,400 Hmong in the La Crosse county, the community.
TV:Now where did the Hmong come from? Anybody have any idea? Where did the Hmong come from? Yes? Laos. Ok. Where is Laos? This country next to Vietnam, wonderful. I have a picture of Laos. This is the globe. This is the world right? Here you see the little pink here that's Laos. This is the country where the Hmong came from and here is Vietnam. Cambodia, Thailand, China, and Burma. This country China is where 7million live today. Probably more than that. Laos- here, probably I would say about the same number. Maybe 4 or 5 hundred thousand Hmong live today. That's about 250,000 live in the United States today, as we talk. OK, so when I talk about Southeast Asia refugees, or when you got to different school, the community, you got to places, and when they talk Southeast Asia refugees. Who are they talking about? They talking about mainly the people who live here in the United State today from the country Laos, South Vietnam, Cambodia. That's all. Ok, and these are what we call political refugees. We also have people who came here as immigrant.
TV:Anybody know the different between an immigrant and a refugee? Ok, An immigrant it's a people who came here because they like the country. Because they have a job here. Or maybe they have a family here. They want to move here . but a refugee are those people who came here because the war cause of fighting . Because they have to get out otherwise different governments would punish them. So he Hmong came here as political refugees because the United States involvement in Cambodia, Laos, and Vietnam.

TVUE303,Fighting The War,Thai Vue,January 31st 2001,Transcribed by Callie and Alyssa

TV: The Hmong fight the communists with the United States government. Okay.
TV: So when we lose the United State Government said you can come to the United States because you work with us, you help us fight fight the war.
TV: Laos look like this you probably have seen this map before right. Anybody seen this map before? It's a long its kinda long okay. Again, this is today its called Vietnam, but when it was in Laos this is North Vietnam and this is South Vietnam. Okay. Cambodia down here and Thailand. So, this is where the Hmong, mostly the Hmong live along here, in this part of the country very close to the Vietnam border. I was born right here, very close to the Vietnam border. About seven miles from the Vietnam border, that's where I was lived and born.
TV: In here the border between Laos and Thailand there is a river here it is called the Mekong river, its about the size of the Mississippi River and to get from Laos to Thailand you have to cross the river. Okay so I'll talk about the river a little bit later.
TV: The question again why did the Hmong people come to the United States? The war this is an actual picture that in the training camp okay this is a military training camp. This picture here is general Vang Pau. A people know him as Vang Pau okay, and this gentleman here is kernel Sida Xiong. He live in Milwaukee today right now so he this is his troops.
TV: Trained to go and to fight the North Vietnamese. Okay. This picture here is show the enemies is what we call. This a North Vietnamese soldier that came to Laos, he fought and we captured, so he was born there. Does everybody see the hat? So you capture and then you also have to treat them well and give them food and give them medicine too. Okay but during the fight you could also kill a lot of people. Okay ah this war is started for fifteen years it started in 1960 about 1960 and it go all the way to 1975. Okay that's the end of the war in Laos where the United States government tell you know its solider this case the soldiers that were sent to Laos to help you know train soldiers its called the CIA okay.
TV: Anybody know the CIA? The CIA is a secret army for the United States. Okay so hey send the secret army to train le in Laos. To train us to fight with the north Vietnamese in Laos okay ah but. This picture shows the veterans that fought in the war for 15 years. From 1960 to 1975 and now they live in this country okay. So many live in La Crosse here, they're soldiers and then the wife of the soldier many of the children, I would say all of the children come to school here everyday are children of the veterans. Okay this is a picture of a soldier you see this is the bazooka that they used to shoot. Okay any of you ever seen this kind of bazooka, its its pretty long this way. Okay pretty big you carry on your shoulder and you shoot the enemy when they come they go like BOOM! Like that okay. The Hmong fought on the side of the United States. In Laos the Hmong lost the war and then the United State government pulled their soldiers back t the United States. And then the Hmong came after, that's why we live here today.

TVUE403,Life After War,Thai Vue,January 28, 2002,Transcribing by Joy and Mary

TV: Now, what I'd like to talk about now is how the Hmong get to this country. Okay, how did the Hmong people actually came here. I talk about the war in Laos and how we live in Laos. But after 1975… most of you born probably not 1975 right? (laughing) Okay, I have children born in 1976, 1980, '81, '88. This is seventh grade right? You are seventh graders. My younger child that’s in 8th grade (so he?) is about… almost 14. Most of you probably are 13 12 right? So what I'm going to talk about now is how did the Hmong get to the United States. Yes?
SC: Did you fight in the war?
TV: Yes, I fought in the war, but not as long as many people. I were in the war for about a year and a half at the end of the war in 1972 '73. But my father was in the war all the time in his life. My cousins, many of my cousins were in the war all the time. And I have 2-3 first cousins that die in the war. 'Cause as you know, they fought in the war. That’s all we have?
SC: What was going through your head in the war?
TV: Scary, you go in the war, fight, and you think, "Am I going to die? Am I going to go back to see my mom and my dad, my sister? But for many people who have children-already married and have children, and live in Laos and fight in the war, they gonna say, "If I die, what's gonna happen to my children, my wife?" My brother-in-law who get shot pretty bad in the war early about in 1966 or 1967, and he was very fearful because had at the time he had and kid, one child. And his wife which is my sister. And he was wounded pretty bad and we were very scared not even just for the soldier, but for the family it’s a very scare if you son or daughter.
Well, you son mostly, not many girl in the war fighting, mostly men. You will be afraid that maybe your son won't come back because a soldier, a communist soldier, will kill him. Scary stuff.
SC: What were some of the other weapons that you used?
TV: At the time we have a m-15 later we have a m16. I think you probably have seen some one with a m16. Any one ever seen a m-16… weapon? It's an automatic rifle, it can shoot trrrrrrrr! Like that. Okay. Very early in probably in about 1962 in that time we had what do you call a it's a long rifle in Hmong we call it 'paw eu tay.'
You can shoot eight time a single sot. So we call it eight shot rifle very long one very heavy very shot very far, but later we have a m-15 which is shorter one very light then we have m-16 those are some of the small guns that you can carry. But they also you know a gun that would shoot a little rocket, when you put it a- it would shoot boom! Is that all the question you have?
SC: What was the hardest part about coming to America?
TV: Well, I'm going to talk a little about coming to America. But I'll answer that briefly here. It's a very hard to get out of Laos to go to Thailand and the to come here because people don't just come here, they have to escape from Laos to the neighbor country. It's called Thailand.
TV:And by getting out then a lot of enemies were on the road trying to chase you, stop you, kill you. So, a lot of people died because they was chasen by the communist. A lot of also people also died along the Mekong River because they couldn't find the floating device to use it, so they swing a maybe the device that they use ah fell and then they fell you know drown or sunk down into the river and die in the river. So, a lot of people die like that.
TV:After 1975 and the communist took over in Laos. They also want us to go to what is called a re- education program where you know they they took the people the soldier who fought against them to go to a to train again so they don't turn against you know the communist government. And a lot of people there took it and never came back and they didn't want to go and they were forced out to go to fight against them, that's what I did. They took it over about 1975.
TV:About five months later is when you know they told us to go to the education programs we didn't want to go and they gonna arrest us to go, so we went into the jungle and fight against them. So we were fighting with them.
I fought in what I call a Civil war for three years before I decided to leave Laos. When you fought and the communists took over the village and the town. So when you fought with them, you have to run to the jungle when you run to the jungle you don't have food to eat. Okay so you have to eat the plants that available in the jungle. So, a lot of people die from eating the wrong plants.
Anybody ever go to the woods to gather something that you can eat veg-vegetables in the woods here? Anyone done that? You done that, okay. Yeah, berry if you go out to the woods you probably find something you can eat cook, you can eat. You can eat raw ? This is one of the tree, what I call, I don't know the name but I call it by cocoa tree. It's like a cocoa tree, but it is not a cocoa tree exactly. Okay, It doesn't produce coconut. But it is in that family. This tree inside of it has a very most of it will have a very rich juice inside the tree. You can make Jell-O out of it, okay but you have to cut it down, you have to have an axe to cut it down so when you live in the jungle this is one type of food you can eat.

TVUE503 ,Crossing the River ,Thai Vue,January 28, 2002,Transcribed by Eric and Kevin

TV: So you were talking about crossing the river. Can you imagine how
people cross the river this how I cross the river? Ok, this the Mekong.
This is Thailand. I cross twice we came down twice. And this is the
second time we made. I will talk a little bit tabout he first
time that you know those plastic bag the trash bag. You blow it right
then you tie it. And then you put a piece of cloth around it. You saw
a piece clo the and stalk it than you blow it and this side and this side
than you can lay on it. Ok a same thing. This drawing right here is I
Thai Vue. This here is my Mic. on my back and then this is my wife and
my son. He is 25 now living in La Crosse here. He goes to UWL. This
is my mother. My father died when we came then its only 123 forwards.
TV:So you can you see this string right here. The string actually tight to
them and tight to my back. So I can pull them. Some family has 12
people its very heavy like you hold something if you hold little it's
not heavy. If you hold little it's not heavy. If you pull a lot it's
heavy. So if you pull 10-12 people it probably take you much longer. But
cause I only have 3 people actually 2 because one is little it took me
about 1 hours to get to the other side.
TV:And then when we get to Thailand then we surrender our souls to the Thai
people the village. But then they took us over to the camp and I live in the refugee.
I live in the refugee camp for one year before I came to the United State. But I
like to share what to you about my story that I almost got kill being
during my journey to um Thailand. The group that we ah came together.
Do you have a question?
PT: What did you bring with you when you crossed the river?
TV: The clothes that I wear, nothing but my gun my m16. I have a
spare pair of clothes the same as my wife and my mom and a some money
some silver bar that we can exchange for a money to buy stuff food to
eat and buy clothes at different times, but nothing else basically.
Everything lost in the war.

TVUE603,Assault Near the Mekong ,Thai Vue,January 28, 2002,Transcribed by Abe and Joe

TV: I’m going to tell you my story of how I almost died and got shot by a bullet by a communist soldier.
Way we lived the way we were hiding to the boulder well it’s not very far but when you travel by foot it took
us seven days. Have you ever walked seven days? Anyone here I walked more than seven days that’s how
long it took me to get to the boulder. So, here ago, leave the jungle were we where fighting with 67 people,
children, girl, man ok and then we travel for six days. And then we got to the river very close to the river so
we rested our family very close to the river about from here to the Mississippi River and then leave several of
our soldiers. We went to the river to find a way to the river and to see if we can find any boat and then we
could come back to take the family.
TV:So the first night we left five people went to the river I went to the river three of those crossed the river by
swimming across to Thailand to get some boat so the next night we could come back and get our family.
When they left for Thailand the first night and the second night I along with three other solders went back to
the river to try to make contact to see if they got a boat. And then they couldn’t make the connection because
when the three soldiers swam across to Thailand, the people there said a lot of enemies were waiting to stop
communist soldiers.
TV:Then we went back to the river and they were on the other side. We walked along the shore for about four
hours, until midnight. When we finally connected we were using a flashlight, and we never really used a
flashlight before. We did a lot of signaling, with the flashlight and walky talky. We used that signal and they
said you could not come because there are enemies. They wanted us to go back so we stopped.
On the second night, I alone with three soldiers went back to meet our family to tell them that we didn’t find
any enemies on the shore. There we walked north and south for about a mile. We decided to go back again.
TV:On the third night, four other soldiers, and my nephew were to cross the river and get a boat. We stayed
with our family until about four o’clock in the evening. It was not dark yet, it was still daylight, so we walked
for about twenty miles. I was the last person and another person with a gun was next to me with my cousin
and another soldier. We were walking pretty fast to the river and the guy who was leading us has never been
to the river so he was always getting lost. When you go a couple of times we get a track or a path. He kept
getting lost and then we had to find the trail.
TV:Then I said," Gentlemen, let me take the lead. I don’t have a gun but we need to get there quickly. We
need to get there by dark or it will be hard to find the way." When I lead the way I walked fast. While we
were walking a group of communist soldiers were following us. The communist soldiers were coming this
way so we could run into each other. There were probably 20 or 25 communist soldiers coming and trying to
fight us. They found our tracks and were upset. I took a wrong path where we might have collided. We went
on an elephant trail.
TV:Has anybody see an elephant? In Laos there are a lot of elephants. In fact it used to be called the land of a
million elephants. Now it’s called Laos. In Laos there is a lot of elephant trouble in the forest and in the
woods. I misunderstood where the elephant trail was going this direction. And then the rest of the people
were following me but the last person who just got here on this trail when they cross that’s when the enemies
came. As it turned left about 20 yards I saw a fallen tree on the trail. That’s when I noticed it was a wrong
turn. I turned around to my partner and said. Partners I took a wrong turn this is not correct. There was no
tree across the trail. So they stopped and looked at the trail last person was right here like this my on the trail
go this.
TV:I and another person who was very close to me about this far and then we looked around. Looked around
and talked like this because we didn’t think that there were any enemies. Then the enemies heard me talking
and they take their position in the tree. So when this guy said, "Hey guy the trail crosses this way". I said ok,
lets go there lets cross over. When the trail crosses like this and then this is according to the second person.
He saw a communist soldier because the soldiers were also hiding in the tree, but he was hiding on this side
where we were coming from so as they were approaching him we went over to the other side. And the first
reaction from the first person who survived said, "How come That’s are already there.
TV:This is the way the enemies stand, like this. And then, can I borrow you for a second, do you mind? No
you don’t have to do anything just be a here. Pretend you are a soldier, the was carrying a rifle. Just stand
like this, I was coming this way and he shot the enemy, shot my partner on the feet here. BANG! Then he fell
down. And then the next person on him turned around like this and then the enemy shot again. BANG! And
he hit this bun right here. He hit this butt so he fell down. You’re done, nice job soldier.
TV:So the first guy he couldn’t go fast because he was shot in the leg, he was crawling. The second person
was shot in the butt because he wasn’t shot in the bone so he could still crawl. He crawled the direction and
the other guy crawled in this direction. Then the enemy shot him and he died. Bang! Bang! My first reaction
was I said to my partner," What are they shooting?" I thought that my partner was shooting, not the enemy. I
thought that they were shooting something. Then I heard an automatic rifle go durururururur! Just like that.
TV:Right now I can still see the leaves and the way that the smoke smelled. Then the first round shot hit my
partner right in the forehead and fell down and he was dead. Because I was right behind him I fell down. I
crawled a little bit just like a soldier. I crawled for a little bit than I got up ran.
TV:The enemy was shooting in towards me. I was running the place where we misturned. Then they shot a
small rocket called a B-42 rocket. Have you ever seen a bazooka? Probably not. But when you shoot it it will
explode in the air and kill the people on the ground. The enemy shot it off and then it exploded in a tree. I
was right below it and a shell hit me in the back. Then it probably threw me from here to the wall over there.
It went boom! Has anybody seen a movie where something exploded like that? My first reaction was," I am
smashed now, the only thing left is my head, I’ll be dead in thirty seconds. Maybe less than thirty seconds." I
said," Gee, my son is there, my wife is there and my mother is there along with other people. This is the end
to my like then a the soldier was shooting boom, boom, boom just like that.
TV:Then they were yelling but they were not coming. They stay there I think they were afraid to come after
us too. For about 15-20 seconds I was still breathing. I said "gee I’m still living, I’m not dead yet". That was
even scarier because I knew I thought my back broke and blew up. I thought it was just my head and a little
bit here. The rest of my back would be cut into pieces from the rocket explosion. I tried to sense my toes,
that’s the first thing is to see if my leg is still attached. Then I tried to move my toe and it was moving so I
said, "Gee I still have my foot". That was the reaction I had. I said, "Oh man I have my foot but my leg and
everything else is probably blown up or maybe it was just attached there. " So I’m going to die harder," that
was the reaction I had. Then I said, "Let's check my back to see if anything was here". It was very scary.
TV:Then I put my hands up, that’s what bad especially from being shot so badly. "Then I crawled pretty fast
for about 100 yards. Then I went up too big tree like this. They were still fighting bullets still go around. And
I look at my back and I found a shell go through my pants and found a hole. I took it off and looked at a
piece of metal go right into my butt here and sticking my finger into it and it went into it about this deep here.
It was bleeding, not so bad but there was some blood coming out of there. " I said I’ve been hit once with this
big of hole".